I'm curios, with the large offer of streaming formats we have, what is your choice?
Here is Romania the most used format is aacPlus v2 because of the excellent quality at low bitrates.
I'm asking this because i'm thinking to implement an internal shoutcast/icecast encoder in RDJ because it seems that DSP is not so stable.
Hi Marius!!
I am currently using a Icecast2 server with mp3 64 kbps 44100 Khz.
You can listen here: http://www.nene94.com/radio/stream.pls :angel:
But SHOUTCast is good!.. I like two options! :P
Best regards,!! ;D
...
Hi Marius
We stream (3) Edcast/OddcastV3 >>> MP3 32kbps/22050/Mono, AAC+V2 28kbps/44100/Parametric Stereo, MP3 40kbps/22050/Mono >>> into SHOUTcast Server v1.9.8/win32.
We feel AAC+V2 is a very satisfactory choice.
Marius,
I am using shoutcast (and built in encoder) with 128 mp3 quality. Mp3 because free streaming server does not allow another format like aac. :-(
Peter
I stream with the Oddcast plugin >>> MP3 128kbps - stereo, - on giss.tv streaming server
before this I used myradiostream.com shoutcast plugin, but the servers go down once or twice a day ;-)
Hi,
As i stepped over from Freestreamhosters (shoutcast) to giss.tv (icecast) i must use now oddcast (from 2004) (as edcast crashes with Radio-DJ)
Stream is 128 kbps MP3
PeterP
I prefer everything of quality. Since HE-AAC is not so good at low bitrates as it is seems to be, I started another server on giss.tv and I have MP3 112 kbps stereo as a second stream. The only reason I didn't rised to 128 kbps is because of Croatian Internet which is not so good even nowadays.
I stream 3 streams: 128k shoutcast for high quality large bandwith / 64k aac+ for medium bandwith decent quality (specifically for itunes listeners and mobile smartphone listeners) and mp3 24k mono for lo bandwith listening and lo profile listening at work. If aac+ had an embeddable player I'd drop the 24k mono and run a 32k aac+ stream instead. I find the 64k aac+ stream is ALMOST as as good as 128k shoutcast mp3.
I believe edcast can stream aac+ though I haven't tried. My stream relay provider told me to first download winamp's streamer and the aac+ plug in then with a bit of magic I could configure edcast to do aac+. I haven't tried it, I send a 128k mp3 to the relay server and they transcode from there.
If you build it in, I think you will find a lot of different formats are wanted! IF you do go ahead, seeing the number of listeners on each stream would be a nice thing, though not imperative, I use free radio tools software for that.
Marvin
Guys, what do you think is better format for streaming what regards quality?
MP3, AAC, OGG? What are the pluses and minuses of each from those formats, especially with regards to bandwith problems by streaming?
Thanks in advance.
Peter
Hi all,
I have two streams, 1 low quality 48kHz mono, for mobile internet and 1 higher quality aac+V2 128 for internet at home Both shoutcast. The 2 streams are both at home so the low quality is max 10 listeners and the high quality only 4 users.
I know very small, but it's just for myself en family/friends to play with.
Greetings
Pluk
(edit: shoutcast format)
Hello Marious/guys.
Currently I'm using Shoutcast with MP3 encoder to broadcast my station radio, the main reason is because is the best and easy way to put a flash web player in my web site also I'm using a fb app to plublish on my wall the radio broadcast and only allows MP3 streams; yes I know, we can use diferent music players to listen the broadcast but for me (at least for now) is much better do it in this way.
Best regards from México and thank you Marius, this is a really awesome project.
Shoutcast AAC+ and transcode to mp3 ~ 128 and 24 or 48 for mobile.
I'm using Shoutcast mp3 128kbs, haven't tried anything else yet.
Ian
www.estm.co.uk (http://www.estm.co.uk)
Run 2 streams on my station One is 128 mp3 and the other is 48k AAC+
If all Players (including Flash) Played AAC id stream with just that.
I'm running my Station with IceCast 2 at 128 kbps in stereo.
Quote from: TravisMitchell on May 21, 2011, 10:02:41 AM
I'm running my Station with IceCast 2 at 128 kbps in stereo.
Whats your station???
Shoutcast - MP3 160kbps - stereo - http://tvoetoradio.com/ :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:
OGG @ 64 kbps ROCKS!
i use aacplus v2 with icecast kh sounds ok www.energyfmonline.weebly.com .. i will have free voice over service soon..if you guys are interested please mail me at mayed_12@live.com
I run OGG at 48Kbps/44khz/stereo . To my ears it sounds good and also performs well in mobile applications.
i use 128 k at 48000hz with butt encoder
Hi there!
We're running Shoutcast on 128k 44.1kHz MP3.
We are thinking about going for shoutcast 2.0 and probably rise to 192k mp3.
We're not using RadioDJ yet, but I'm currently looking for alternatives to replace our current system.
So far I only found major 2 things missing:
- built in Encoder for running it unattended on our (v)Server.
- REST or SOAP like remot control
Best Regards from germany
Malte
Quotebuilt in Encoder for running it unattended on our (v)Server.
There is plenty of Encoding software out there Edcast is the Most popular
QuoteREST or SOAP like remot control
Tight VNC is quite good for controlling a computer remotely its what i use to connect to the box streaming from radiodj
What I need is a Remot control via a Webinterface, not a remote Desktop.
We have programmed a webinterface, that allows our djs (sitting in thair own home-studio) to set the Automation OFF-AIR to enable them to switch thair studio online. We don't kick the automation via tha Shoutcast server, because this never works properly and you need several try. It could happen that the players of the listners stop, if you go this way.
So we need a built in Encoder because Edcast can not be remote controlled via a Webinterface, once it is online, it is online. 2nd Problem vServers don't allow to install any Hardware, even a Virtual Sound-Card can not be installed. As RadioDJ uses bass.dll it should not be too difficult to utilize the bass-stream and lame.exe. This is the way mAirList has solved it. mAirList also added a small processing unit that can load VST plugins. At the moment I'm using a simple classic compressor (free) VST.
I understand the point of view, having the encoder external, but especially for germany I think much more users would switch to RadioDJ, because it than could fully replace SAM. Even mAirList (I'm a mAirList user since Version 1.xx) didn't have a built in encoder for very long time, because it is not job auf the automation software to follow the master output of the mixer. Finally an Encoder was built in and we were able to use it for our unattended tasks, this was the point that made the software really successfull.
Back to the remot control I also need to request the current Status of the Automation software to remind the DJ to switch it online again or to send Warning eMail. But I have seen some posts here in the forum, that something is in development progress already, that is going this direction.
Remote Controlling the software can be used in many ways, it must not be limited to a webinterface. Same commands can be used for MIDI, Serial, Hotkeys etc.
If Marius is interested I can write down more ideas about this features in a new thread.
EDIT: The tool is called BassEnc not bass-stream, sorry.
I think the Reason there is no Built in encoder with radioDJ is once again down to licence isssues at least i seem to remember Marius saying something along them lines when it was suggested.
I guess this is due to the Codec license. It is not allowed to supply the lame.exe with the software. It always needs to be downloaded by the User.
It is even not allowed to place a direct link to the download page.
But it is allowed to place a link like http://www.google.com/search?q=lame.exe+download&ie=UTF-8
And I'm pretty sure everybody can find what is needed.
Even Edcast doesn't come with the Lame encoder plugin when you install it. It sends you to a page where you can download it.
I noticed Shorty.xs comments on the features available on Mairlist and suggesting they be added as features
on RadioDJ. After a little checking, he failed to mention those remote features and built in encoder were part
of software that costs $2500 to $4000. At those prices it should be able to stream gold nuggets while
running unattended!!
bugBoy10
Well the price issue is not totally true. Especially all the remote controls were already part of the older free version. It was free for none commercial use. None of the mAirList Version cost $4000. The largest edition costs 1000€, even the update I'd need to buy now would be 500€.
The version (HomeStudio) I use for live assist, cost 99€. The update is 39€, this is OK for what it does.
But for our automation 2 major features are missing in this smaller version. The network database and the remote control via REST interface. It only allows "local" control by hotkeys, game pad, etc.
A lot of features of course can be found in this high price range (like $4000) software. mAirList is clearly going this way and this is the reason why I'm looking if there are alternatives. Because our small radio station can not afford future updates. I can't spend a lot of money, but I can provide a lot of experiance with different automation software and my skills as a computer hardware engineer, and I'm willing to share this to support a very interesting and free software!
Please don't get me wrong, I just share my ideas, it is still up to Marius to decide if these are interesting to implement or not. He needs to spend his time for development, I'm just a user.
By the way bugBoy10 with your argument, you can kill any new feature request, becaus almost any requested feature can be found in high price software. ;) And mAirList is just one example, Propfrexx is almost the same, and I guess there are others.
We have a really big webradio scene here in germany, most of them do have cost issues, so a lot of them don't even own a mixer and use an illegal version of SAM. Once there is an encoder built in you have a fully replacement for SAM, that can be used for free without vialoating any license.
Could you imagine what this could mean for RadioDJ? Hopefully a lot of new (german) users. :)
I will do my part an provide a translation.
Kind regards from germany
Malte
I cant understand why People feel the need to pay such prices for software.
Wouldn't give SAM Shitehouse room ever again. Did have a Play with Mairlist when i first saw it and instantly hated it.
Im sure if Marius could find a way round putting a Built in encoder into RadioDJ he would.
You can DJ on the internet for FREE these days.
RadioDJ - Free
Edcast - Free
Shoutcast from Cloudbroadcaster 25 Slots - Free
I guess the real cost involved is finding a webhost that allows SQL port opening so you can have a half decent website to go with it.
Im expecting Big things to come with RadioDJ eventually it will out perform all the paid for Broadcasting software!
Get the Word out in germany Im sure the word FREE still applies there!
Well not all has to be for FREE, but basicly I'm with you, especially on SAM.
I think SAM and mAirlist do have 1 thing in common. Either you love it or you hate it, there is nothing in between.
mAirList is very complex, but you can set it up exactly to your demands, but this is why it is that complex ;D
RadioDJ is very simple to get startet, if you get used to the layout. I don't get (yet) used to it for live assist, but for Automation. I also love the touchscreen usable interface.
I'm asked very often, what Playout software I'd suggest. My answer always is: I suggest the one that fits your needs.
This is getting really off topic, maybe somone should split this topic into a new one...
I'm using 128kpbs mp3 ;D
listen2myradio.com with edcast standalone. :)
Quotelisten2myradio.com
Shudder! Listen2myradio the shoutcast streams they provide for free really don't hold up that well.
Hello djgarybaldy, I also use 2 more. I use caster fm and live365 too.
im running 64 kpbs mp3 using radio caster and its always stable and i recommend it has its not also expensive like other streaming software
Hi,
I have 2 radiostations running RDJ (2 sep databases), 2 times audio processing (breakaway), 2 times edcast and all on one machine running for a couple of years now. (with every month "or 2" a quick reboot)
Both stations have an mp3 128kb upstream from the studio to a remote server, on that remote server i have installed a transcoder for both streams to transcode them also into 32kb aac+ or whatever else i want.
I noticed that mp3 streams in general atract more listeners than the aac ones.
For RDJ in my situation i would not use a build-in encoder unless it will give me the posibility to choose the input (virtual cable from my broadcast processing), just as now i chosen the output of RDJ to go with virtual cable towards processing input. "Pipelines" as they are called by breakaway software.
Cheers :cool:
Ed.
We use AAC Plus/44.1/32k/Shoutcast/Edcast. Works for us. We have hardware processing however with a Dominator 723. http://www.classicgold.co.nz/
Just stumbled on to this OPUS encoder (acutally its a BUTT hack ) http://kradradio.com/?p=285
Can anyone verify that its working ?
Yep this is working on icecast 2.4 beta and icecast kh branch from version 5 and up!
Quote from: centre state radio on February 07, 2013, 12:29:38 PM
Just stumbled on to this OPUS encoder (acutally its a BUTT hack ) http://kradradio.com/?p=285
Can anyone verify that its working ?
Maybe you are intrested in my setup:
Souceclient edcast standalone streaming to my main icecast (privat) server.
On this server also resides transcoding software called liquidsoap.
Liquidsoap transcodes the delivered stream to 4 types of audio streams and also manipulates the metadata for the streams. On schedules times the name of the program is inserted in the metadata of the stream.
The 4 streams are feeded / mounted again as streams in the main (privat) server.
I keep the server private to keep the bandwith i need to feed the server and to be able to put all cpu energy into this transcoding.
After all above this server is relayed by two public icecast servers where the listereners connect to.
The source stream from the studio to my main icecast server is currently in OGG quality 6.5 or 7 or 8 (expirimenting with that) i wanted to stream in oggFLAC, but the metadata is not delivered to the server in this format currently. bandwith for a flac stream is between 860 to 1100 KBps. I wanted to send the title and artist to the mainserver so i decided to return to OGG at high quality giving at the highest quality a bitrate around 450 to 550 KBps. This should be pretty tranparant for a audio stream, so after delivery on my mainserver i transcode this stream for the listener into 4 streams in lower bitrate.
- mp3 80 KBps joint stereo 44.1 KHz quality 0
- AAC+ 64 KBps stereo v2 44.1 KHz
- Ogg Quality 0 (gives a bitrate of 64 KBps) 2 channnels (stereo) 44.1 KHz
- OPUS 64 KBps vbr="constrained", application="audio", complexity=5, max_bandwidth="super_wide_band", samplerate=48000, frame_size=40., channels=2, signal="music"
Every codec has it's pro's and con's. But in short:
- Mp3 is the most adapted stream type (also the oldest codec), but eating the most bandwith to get a decent sound quality. NOT OPENSOURCE
- AAC+ is performing best at low bitrates gives the impression to sound good, while in reality it fakes a lot. NOT OPENSOURCE
- OGG sounds better then mp3 at same bitrates, but is not that adapted as mp3 and almost as old as mp3. OPENSOURCE
- OPUS a new promessing encoding format, sounds like a mix of aac+ and Ogg. Could be the futher since it's adaptation for several standards on the internet (see http://www.opus-codec.org/). OPENSOURCE
My 2 cents,
Arkadas
I have been experimenting with OPUS using a modified BUTT encoder (a BUTT crack :D) and Icecast 2.4 . on 44000khz and 56 kps . The sound is outstanding and I cant get over how good the stereo seperation is .
The station I am involved with here plans to run its online stream using OPUS as well as AAC plus .
I will put up a link once I have it going :)
I like your setup Arkadas, and i think that it gives you more stability than using many streams directly from the playout software.
I tested many programs with built in encoders and over 90% of them have performance issues when internet connection is slow or when a encoder is trying to re-connect to the server.
Thanks!
if anyone is interested in the config file for liquidsoap, i am happy to give that to the community!
Regards,
Arkadas
I've found my 2 perfect streams with Shoutcast are
1 stream mp3 @128 kbps and another stream AAC+ @48 kbps both streams being ran off the encoding plugin version 1.4. (Cheers SnowHow) Plus i don't even need any external sound processing with the on board Sound processing everything is crystal clear.
I am very happy using shoutcast server with a simple conf, non public and some encoder standalone set to one stream @ 320 44.1. I connect in two places and the bass response is outstanding!
Quote from: Compdoggie on May 24, 2013, 08:43:44 PM
I am very happy using shoutcast server with a simple conf, non public and some encoder standalone set to one stream @ 320 44.1. I connect in two places and the bass response is outstanding!
Strange why you would want your station private and not listed in any directory that sort of defeats the idea of getting listeners. :bash:
I think 320 is too high for streaming with especially if most of your audio is ripped at different bit-rates it would sound naff in places.
Quote from: M9Hobbit on May 24, 2013, 11:55:24 PM
Strange why you would want your station private and not listed in any directory that sort of defeats the idea of getting listeners. :bash:
I think 320 is too high for streaming with especially if most of your audio is ripped at different bit-rates it would sound naff in places.
I'll stick with 128k mp3 and 48 AAC+ both sound perfect.
Unless he gets enough listeners to not need to be listed? And yeah 320k is pretty excessive, must be costing a fortune!
Quote from: Marius on July 30, 2010, 10:01:28 PM
I'm curios, with the large offer of streaming formats we have, what is your choice?
Here is Romania the most used format is aacPlus v2 because of the excellent quality at low bitrates.
I'm asking this because i'm thinking to implement an internal shoutcast/icecast encoder in RDJ because it seems that DSP is not so stable.
Hi Marius,
we have 2 separate streams: one for the listeners and one dedicated to the FM trasmitters.
The listeners stream is a 128K stereo MP3, while the FM trasmitters one is a 128K stereo AAC+.
The AAC+ one sounds absolutely better of course, but we can't deliver it to users because we are worried about players support... Our in-browser Flash stream player doesn't support it, and switching to HTML5 will make it absolutely impossibile to use AAC+ for us at the moment :(
This is what I'm using now:
128kbps mp3 because mp3 is so popular and used by so many services and the quality is acceptable (really drops off below 96kbps).
64kbps Ogg/Vorbis Very good quality, equal or better than 128 mp3 and at half the bitrate. One thing I really like about Vorbis is that it is currently non-proprietary.
24kbps AAC+, Parametric Stereo. Ideally I wouldn't go lower than 32kbps with AAC+ but I like to have a dial-up feed for my streams, not everyone has broadband. Also great for mobile.
Another reason I chose this combination of these formats is that I've started using an HTML5 player for my website and if you run all three formats your HTML5 audio player will work in any browser.
For general usefullness and open-source freedom my dream is that mp3 would just go away and Ogg Vorbis would take it's place.
As to what dodobasi said about HE-AAC (aka AAC+) I don't think his statement about it's low bitrate quality could be farther from the truth. A 32kbps AAC+ is nearly indistinguishable from 128kbps MP3, bump that AAC up to 48kbps and there is no question of equal quality but at a much lower bandwidth.
So what do I say? Use 'em all if you want to make sure you are heard around the world.
Hi Marius !
aac ++ v2 and mp3
Very good idea a encoder integre in Radiodj :ok:
I've spent the best part of 2/3 years messing about with the configuration of my streams I've gone from 48 kbps AAC+ to 128kbps Mp3 to 64kbps OGG Vorbis and Opus and back again.....
Now the encoder plugin has sample rate support I've finally found a bitrate I'm happy with. Now streaming @96kbps with a Sample rate of 22050. As well as one stream on OGG Scrub the ogg bit icecast kept crashing on us.
It sounds crisp and clear to my ears..... Even sounds good through my android phone in Winamp!
If you want to hear how it sounds [link removed by admin]
It's been great fun testing various theories ......
Quote from: Marius on July 30, 2010, 10:01:28 PM
I'm curios, with the large offer of streaming formats we have, what is your choice?
Here is Romania the most used format is aacPlus v2 because of the excellent quality at low bitrates.
I'm asking this because i'm thinking to implement an internal shoutcast/icecast encoder in RDJ because it seems that DSP is not so stable.
ACC Plus & Mp3 should cover all needs Marius. Great Idea an internal encoder. I've been on Mp3 64k 44.100 but now thinkingto go to Acc
i use some encoder stream into icecast 192 kbit 44100 stereo ;)
I use 128 kbit mp3 44100
I've finally settled on 128k mp3 22050 sample rate streaming with the plugin that Marius wrote.
Sounds OK through our new sound system. Streaming faultlessly at the moment* (*broadband connection permitting)
Same here Gary, broadband permitting. I am 128k AACP and 44100. I am wanting to try 48K as I have done before.
Quote from: DJ Garybaldy on April 11, 2015, 10:57:18 AM
I've finally settled on 128k mp3 22050 sample rate streaming with the plugin that Marius wrote.
Sounds OK through our new sound system. Streaming faultlessly at the moment* (*broadband connection permitting)
We are using 64k aac at our stations. This one seems to yield the best sound / lowest bandwidth ratio.
The better the codec, the more solid the sound, and less propensity to decay over time (without rebooting).
64k is very nice for mobile users. 128k is OK too. It all depends on where and what they are listening on. If they are on most modern cell networks 128k should be no issue.